There have been three new developments concerning under-attack Purplebricks.
In the first, well-known estate agent Trevor Kent has complained to the advertising watchdog about a Purplebricks TV advert.
Kent, a former president of the NAEA and high-profile media pundit, is challenging Purplebricks’ claim that they are “not just online estate agents”. He is arguing that in fact they are only online agents, and that for Purplebricks to suggest otherwise is misleading.
Kent’s complaint to the Advertising Standards Authority is as follows: “In their television advert featuring the father of the bride in a wedding reception scene berating the new son-in-law, the actor says that ‘Purplebricks are ‘not just online estate agents’.
“My complaint is that this is an inaccurate description of their services.
“They ARE an online only estate agent because the public would rightly expect non-online agents to have traditional branches open to the public.
“Purplebricks do not have such branches and thus I contend this advert is misleading to the public.”
In the second development, reviews site allAgents has upped the ante in its war with Purplebricks.
allAgents has now called for an independent audit of Purplebricks’ 96% approval rating via reviews on Trustpilot.
It follows last week’s research note from Jefferies which claimed Purplebricks’ sales success rate was just over 51%. On Radio 5Live at the weekend, Purplebricks’ UK boss Lee Wainwright said that Purplebricks sells 78% of its listings, explaining this was measured by homes sold subject to contract.
allAgents has been involved in a long-running legal dispute with Purplebricks over the validity of negative reviews posted on the allAgents site. Purplebricks says that a number are fakes, while some others cannot be authenticated.
Yesterday Martin McKenzie of allAgents said: “By their own admission, Purplebricks fail to sell 22% of properties, which means one in five customers didn’t get what they paid for.
“Their 96% approval rating on Trustpilot is highly questionable when you have this number of customers who may well be aggrieved. But when it’s almost 50%, that’s just impossible.
“Purplebricks refuse to disclose the number of properties they sell, and use their Trustpilot score to claim to customers and the City they’re somehow more popular than Disney. This just doesn’t add up.
“It’s high time Purplebricks’ Trustpilot reviews were inspected by an independent source, in the same way their financial accounts are.
“We carried out our own internal investigation into the Purplebricks reviews on our site after they repeatedly threatened us with legal action.
“We stand behind our reviews – they’re genuine customer complaints. We’d be very happy for our Purplebricks reviews to be independently inspected, too.”
In the third development, aspirant trade body CIELA has been told that its new complaint to the ASA about Purplebricks will not be investigated but referred straight to the ASA’s compliance team.
The complaint alleges that on a Purplebricks online calculator which gives savings customers can make vis a vis traditional agents, there is no wording to say that the fee is payable whether the property sells or not. CIELA said this breaches an earlier ruling.
The ASA has now told CIELA: “We will refer this matter directly to our compliance team to take action; the compliance team does not report to complainants or publish the details of its work, but please be assured that it will address the problem.”
Carry-on misleading – “Infamy! infamy! They’ve all got it infamy!”
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All this going on by PB brings to mind all the things that the public perceive about estate agents being wrong and undesirable characters. After all these years of improving our standards, they risk destroying all that good work with their doggy spin machine.
The sooner this PLC is brought before a selects committee of MP’s the better. I think the whole country would want a public holiday to be able to watch it live on TV!
Someone once said that it only needs a web petition to parliament get the ball rolling?
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Lol! Very good Mr Wood.
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Talk about – “Sit back and grab the popcorn!”
This is going to be a total hoot…
Anyone got access to a popcorn factory?… I want to place a BIG order!
Ok – I’m ready…Let proceedings commence…
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Mr Bradbury
With respect – this isn’t a situation where someone of your influence and standing in our industry should be sitting back munching popcorn.
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Glad my comment resonated with someone!
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Either you have a pro-Purple namesake, Mr Bradbury – or your idea of not sitting back and enjoying the show is very different to what I had in mind…
https://uk.trustpilot.com/users/5a79e45664c8174c8cf38515
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Does the compliance team of the ASA actually have a set of teeth rather than the usual ‘gummy ‘ informal resolution?
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Certainly have for cases of gross misconduct and repeated offending they can impose a lifetime banning order within Estate Agency … ooops share price dive?
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Let’s be clear about this ‘clear means clear’ and the ASA representative made it clear on the radio on Sunday that all adverts should be clear!
So to make it perfectly clear to everyone watching the TV adverts the fact that a fee is payable whether the property is sold or not should be given equal prominence to the ‘don’t charge commission’ – spoken with equal emphasis, not just in a little bit of writing on for a few seconds that no one reads!
Is that clear ASA?
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Have you ever noticed that the small print in their adverts is deliberatly shown with a background that makes it near impossible to read.
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Absolutely….its CLEARLY by design!
Anything to make people pick up the phone or make contact without being aware of the full facts. Isn’t making contact in any shape or form a transactional decision?
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Now we are going to see if the ASA actually does anything when someone basically sticks two fingers up at them.
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Or just hides for a bit until it appears to have been forgotten!
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Not defending PB here but most agents would fail to sell 15 to 20% of their stock. This will be because vendors change their mind, lose the house they were after or have a change in personal circumstances. The PB boys still get paid while the traditional agents just incur costs.
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But that has never been the issue. The issues have always been a complete lack of clarity on fees when advertising and the fudging of figure when it comes to units sold. If a director stands up and states that his company have sold x% of units the public need explanation as to what sold means and clearly following the interview on the radio, burple *ricks believe that once they have an offer accepted the property is sold!
The next campaign from real agents, started by Kate on the same programme is to explain to the public that getting an offer is not sold but just the start of the sales process. Clearly the public do not understand this as one of the “satisfied” pb customers on the programme was boasting that they had sold his house in just 16 days; how many sales can you recall exchanging/completing in 16 days? Clearly what he was saying was that he’d had an acceptable offer in 16 days which, for many agents is not unusual is it?
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In the current market in our area you typically get an acceptable offer the moment a property is promoted for sale…..it doesn’t mean it’s going to be the best offer of course!
But we all know that it’s dead easy to click a button to say the property is SSTC. It means very little until the sale completes…..but the Call Centre Listers use any statistic they can to make themselves look better!
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Last week we heard about an estate agency that failed in its claim for commission when the vendor argued they didn’t tell him they sold a flat opposite his for £50K more. I suggested this might have turned on CPR rules of disclosure of fact that might influence a ‘transactional decision’.
I wonder whether CPR applies in the case of a company taking payment up front that fails to inform a potential client that they only sell about half of the properties they take on?
If it does then certain firms better start making provision for a tidal wave of refund claims.
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That’s a very good point. And of course it wouldn’t be hard for the ambulance chasing companies to find details of which customers this applies to.
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Perhaps this is a comment that should be on the lead story today. However, is anyone else thinking that Purple Bricks haven’t really helped the housing system?
National, dubious adverts, their lack of sales chasing ability, then add the fact that they aren’t particularly great at communicating with clients after they’ve signed them up and taken their money. It all equates to clients not moving home and feeling frustrated.
I often wonder if the 50% of completions would even be that high if it wasn’t for the assistance of experienced traditional Agents during a transaction…
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Also what isnt clear…is the 51.6% all Purplebricks completions, or just the completions of properties that Purplebricks originally listed. IE i would suggest that an amount of the 51.6% were actually completed sales by an alternative estate agent
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The worse part of it all is the national marketing and advertising ridiculing other smaller fellow members of the same industry, whilst the representative bodies such as the NAEA appeared to agree by being totally complicit with lack of any action or response.
I can’t help but think that members of the public with little interest in our industry, looking at what’s gone on over the last 3 years, will be thinking ‘ they’re all just as bad as one another!’
They have done their best to destroy any perception of professionalism within our industry….for the sake of lining their own pockets!
BSOS23PC
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AgentV,
Estate Agents were one of the least trusted professions before PB came on the scene. Why do you think the PurpleBricks adverts are so well liked?
You are right the public probably think it’s just par for the course when they read about Estate Agents reporting Purplebricks.
If you listen to the BBC 5Live report there’s an agent talking and he tells how much they’ve had to reduce fees and then quotes 1% + VAT. Isn’t this actually illegal? He has to quote 1.2% surely?
You are all as bad as each other as far as I’m concerned.
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You are all as bad as each other as far as I’m concerned. Perfect way to depart from a forum that you have added absolutely nothing to in all the months you have been here. Stick to EAT (John) or LSE in future.
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>you have added absolutely nothing to in all the months you have been here
I’ve just added the information “If you listen to the BBC 5Live report there’s an agent talking and he tells how much they’ve had to reduce fees and then quotes 1% + VAT.” which nobody else had mentioned.
So a little bit of balance.
PropertyPundit, what have you ever added to the discussion?
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For once, I agree with you John. The agent should have quoted a fee including VAT. If he had been talking to a client, I would hope that he would correct and excuse himself and go on to quote an inclusive fee. That said, you are merely attempting to deflect, as usual, from what PB PLC is in the firing line for having seemingly made claims they cannot substantiate (again).
Will you, equally concede, that Purplebricks PLC have made claims they are unable to substantiate? (please don’t trot out the usual “no one else does”). If any agent, but particularly a PLC, makes any claim they have to be able to substantiate it or, don’t make the claim, it’s quite simple. Just ask the TSOs’, CAP, FCA or LSE etc. etc.
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I am not trying to deflect, I am trying to add balance. I would like to see as much scrutiny of traditional agent practices as there is of PurpleBricks’.
The record shows that PurpleBricks have been unable to substantiate claims.
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You know what Cyberduck….I have kept my cool with you long enough. If you knew half the truth behind the company you would understand where I come from. Trust me when I say I know a lot more than you do!
Why don’t you just paddle off into the distance and take your never ending preconceived ideas and wide sweeping statements with you.
Spend some time on concentrating on something worthwhile like saving the NHS before it gets taken over by Americam companies looking to make huge profits by replacing doctors with artificial intelligence …. because it’s all about Full Blood Counts, U & E’s, LFT’s, short synacthen, ultrasound, CT, PET, MRI scan and test results nowadays init! And far lower paid people can carry all those out.
Two week training course and you can help the computer interpret the results to form a diagnosis. Save the NHS hundreds of millions by not having to pay experienced doctors a lot of money each year.
Oh I forgot….you would like that to happen wouldnt you, because you could invest in the American companies shares and make a significant profit for yourself.
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>Trust me when I say I know a lot more than you do!
Trust you? Your are the agent who said they wouldn’t publish your rates because then another agent would advertise at a lower price aren’t you?
Sorry, I’ll trust what I know. Traditional Agents find it very difficult to tell you how much they charge. They’ll charge you twice as much for the same work if your property is worth double another one and they’ll reduce the amount they charge if you know you can barter with them.
How can you defend that? How can you defend charging a percentage of the value of the property?
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And how can you defend getting paid for a job that you don’t do??
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But you don’t know what we all do, and I would suggest that the majority of agents that post on this site are people that want to do a good job for a reasonable fee …and care about what they do. That is why they talk on this site.
You are targeting the wrong audience Cyberduck…You are good at taking little phrases with no context and using them against people at any stage (even though you know nothing about the character of that person), so you need to find a site with loads of people on looking to greedily make more money at every opportunity…. or perhaps you have already found one elsewhere?
Why don’t you use your obvious talent attacking other people looking to make thousands of pounds (or maybe tens of thousands) out of doing nothing more than pressing a button to transfer some money?
BSOS23PC
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AgentV,
The problem I see with the comment section of this site is that it is unbalanced. All you see is the same old Estate Agents ignoring the faults with traditional agents and the model they’ve been using for years and trying to damage a company which is offering something different. A flat low fee where the homeowner takes on the risk as to whether the property sells or not. Something that is quite clear when you sign up to the agreement.
When consumers have an independent agency publishing fees and conversion rates for all Estate Agents then the consumer will be able to make informed decisions. In the meantime we’ll have various parties spinning things to benefit themselves.
I have no problem with people in business trying to make money but it’s the hypocrisy that I find distasteful.
I hear from some of you that it’s not about any company in particular but how many companies have we seen data for from Jefferies? Just one 🙂 Yet we were promised data for the likes of CWD, Foxtons & Connels. Foxtons of course being honest enough to publish their 3% fees but nobody else seems to be.
I’m sorry but to me it is clear what is going on and that is the industry is trying to preserve the status quo. Of course if you can point me to people going to the lengths they go to now, prior to PurpleBricks being a threat, I might reconsider my opinion.
Good luck to the disruptors as far as I’m concerned. The public will be the beneficiaries and the more independently verified information we have the better.
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I have no problem with people in business trying to make money but it’s the hypocrisy that I find distasteful.
You were looking in the mirror when you made that statement! Time for you to bow out, you have never contributed EVER to improvement, just your pet hate for estate agents and you backing of a horse which was always handicapped and you buried your head in the sand hoping it would win the race … it is flagging and about to falter at the next hurdle and you don’t like it one bit. That hurdle is honesty.
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Woodentop,
I believe I have contributed. Some of the articles on here have had mistakes and I’ve pointed this out. Many of the comments on here have been misleading and I have pointed this out.
What have you contributed?
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Yep but never highlight the misleading PB. As for my contribution …. where have you been, you really do make a chump of yourself.
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cyberduck46
I’m sorry but to me it is clear what is going on and that is the industry is trying to preserve the status quo.
If you knew what has been going on behind the scenes, you would realise that nothing could be further from the truth.
Was I not right when I warned you a few weeks ago that investment in PB at that time was a bad idea. Everyone in the industry could see the first part of what was coming….and I always believed the whole stock market (particularly America) was over valued anyway with no large corrections for years!
Still, with PB, we are only on stage 1…. stages 2 and 3 are on their way, but not as obvious as stage 1.
You have also put a fire in me to develop stage 4 a lot quicker as well.
BSOS23PC
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Spot on Mark, we saved two sales with Purplebricks further down the chain last year, we had to to basically take over the sales progression and also assisted PB’s buyer with survey issues. (luckily in my area they only account for about 1.5% of instructions)
Without us, the chain would have collapsed as PB’s LPE and the conveyancers just weren’t interested in going the extra yard. We also lost another sale as a seller got fed up after 5 months and pulled out.
And their Solicitors…well, i think we all know what they are like. And just so you know I am not a bitter, whingeing Estate agent: (Duck & Dom)
http://legalbeagles.info/forums/forum/legal-forums/housing-property-and-neighbours/conveyancing-issues/89536-purple-bricks-conveyancing
I have yet to lose a valuation to PB, I keep a copy of their contract with me so if clients ask about them I just show them the contract and explain the conveyancing fees (in my area the difference is normally just a few hundred £)..It’s that easy.
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Davethehedgehog
would really like to talk to you about an idea. Can you contact me at in@agentv.co.uk please?
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Sounds like a contract that needs publishing!
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This is so true Dave, we are working twice as hard on any transaction such as this.
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Sooner or later it will all come crashing around them! Yes you are right Mr Rowe they have not helped the housing market at all.
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Put my pink shirt on today to celebrate 100 years of the first women to get the vote.
Always let justice win out in the end!
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PB share price is no longer in the upward swing.
It’s still seriously over valued (in my opinion) but how long will the punters keep propping up this oversized ego.
#deaddinosuarwalking
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‘‘UK boss Lee Wainwright said that Purplebricks sells 78% of its listings, explaining this was measured by homes sold subject to contract.”
How many of the 78% of its listings that become STC actually progress to exchange contracts. i.e. become SOLD. Seems a simple question to me.
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>Kent, a former president of the NAEA and high-profile media pundit, is challenging Purplebricks’ claim that they are “not just online estate agents”. He is arguing that in fact they are only online agents, and that for Purplebricks to suggest otherwise is misleading.
Doesn’t the fact that they have local property experts who visit your home substantiate the claim that they are not just online agents?
What do others think?
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NO.
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give us an alternative to having a high street/office presence
High street agents are on line and on the high street and work on no sale no fee.
PB offer 1/3rd of this package and charge upfront whether the house sells or not and are therefore not more than just on line estate agents.
I think Mr Kent makes a just point
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Property Paddy,
Purplebricks aren’t claiming to have offices on the high street or that they are no sale no fee, so I’m not sure why you bring those points up. By saying they are not just an online agent they are being truthful are they not?
>He is arguing that in fact they are only online agents, and that for Purplebricks to suggest otherwise is misleading.
Do you not think “just” and “only” means 100% online?
Unless there’s more to it than is being reported I can’t really see the ASA saying PB are misleading by saying they aren’t just online agents.
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I think your comment acually supports Kents argument !
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No….. a photographer can take pictures and put an advert up online, anybody can say yes to what an owners wants to market their house for…or even give them a list of land registry recorded sales as a guide. That is not being an agent!
A good agent will look at each property and design the best strategy to sell it for the highest price possible. He or she will make sure every part of the representation of that property is considered and maximised to full benefit to generate maximum interest. They will take into account local marketing conditions, the ‘opposition’ properties for sale, demand etc. They will cross reference to known local buyers and those interested in similar properties in the past. They will monitor closeley the interest after launch and adjust anything that needs doing accordingly.
They will carry out many of the viewings to make sure they know what buyers are thinking and saying, to encourage offers…to ‘sell’ the property. They will verify all offers and make sure the buyer is in a good position to proceed. The will then monitor closely the sale from start to completion making sure that everyone is kept informed along the way and little problems and issues are overcome before they become major.
They will make sure that the whole process is undertaken, dealing regularly with solicitors and other agents as well as the vendor and the buyer, in a timely fashion that is as least stressful for the owner as possible. They will do all this and more knowing that they only get paid for any of it when the sale completes. Typically the whole process from start to finish can take up to a weeks working hours in time.
You simply cannot provide that level of service for the cost of less than the day rate a plumber will charge for changing your boiler (which is what one of their listers gets paid)….end of story
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Yeah, working out of your car or spare bedroom/utility must count surely?
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“Doesn’t the fact that they have local property experts who visit your home substantiate the claim that they are not just online agents?”
Nope – but your question perfectly showcases your woeful understanding of our industry and its’ requirements.
#duckshoot
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Well seeing as nobody here has enlightened me I’ll have to wait for the ASA decision. Does anybody know the case reference?
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It has been mentioned and explained so many times over the past year or so. If you haven’t got a grasp of the situation there is no hope for you. Interesting, as you have always argued your point against! Maybe you should call yourself “cyberostrich69”, head in the sand and it doesn’t matter which way up.
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Woodentop, please point me to the explanation. I don’t recall the definition of an online agent being discussed and I often stated that the only online agent (hybrid) that I have looked at is PurpleBricks.
I frequently see the distinction betweeen a hybrid and online agent being mentioned though so I’d be really interested to know if PurpleBricks are simply an online Agent or whether they are something more which is what they claim.
Until I see some standard definition I’ll stick to my opinion that PurpleBricks are more than simply an online agent and will be happy to be proved wrong when I see the ASA decide that they aren’t if that’s the case.
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Missed most of this because, you know, work, but *** sake cyberduck, are Amazon not an online company because they have physical warehouses and a mammal puts it through the door or with a neighbour?
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htsnom79,
I suspect that the ASA will decide that PB are allowed to claim they are not just online estate agents because they offer a service that is more than pure online agents. i.e. they have LPEs who come out to your home.
The article has been updates since my earlier comments and this has been added “They ARE an online only estate agent because the public would rightly expect non-online agents to have traditional branches open to the public.”
I don’t think that argument will be successful. It doesn’t have to be one or the other. I believe you can have degrees and PurpleBricks are simply saying they are more than an online agent. I don’t believe for a second the public will assume this means they have traditional branches and I expect the ASA to agree with me.
Did you listen to the 5Live broadcast? In that there was a lady who clearly thought there was no face to face communication when they were talking about online agents. I think that is generally what the public will think when you refer to online agents and PurpleBricks are not misleading when they say they are more than that.
That’s my opinion anyway and I’ll leave it at that. Let’s see how far the application gets and I’ll quite happily hold my hand up if I’m proved wrong but I will also expect the same from those who have claimed I am wrong if the claim gets nowhere.
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Well, then we’ll have to see, but it’s not the same, as it’s not the same using the lawyer hub model as it is using high street, you make the same mistaken assumption as Alison and countrywide, it’s not retail it’s bespoke unless you want to argue that selling your biggest asset and liability is no different to any other asset you buy or sell
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Your wasting your time with cyberostrich69. He hasn’t a clue, doesn’t want to listen and is more often than not, wrong. He just can’t come to terms when he is wrong.
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Oh, ducky.
ducky… ducky…ducky.
Here’s the thing. NOW you want to argue the toss (pun intended) as to whether or not your pet project is an ‘x’-Estate Agent or a ‘y’- Estate Agent.
The thing is – EVEN THEY don’t know.
For a company that now describes itself as “a hybrid estate agent”, they seem quick to state to The City as recently as 2 Feb (after their raggeddy rug was proper pulled by the Jefferies Report) that their
“Online market share increased in January 2018 to 77%”
And previous to that, stated in their Interim results release on 13 December:
“UK Online market share increased to 74%”
Funny, that – innit?
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“Doesn’t the fact that they have local property experts who visit your home substantiate the claim that they are not just online agents?”
Nope – but your question perfectly showcases your woeful understanding of our industry and its’ requirements.
Thanks for that.
#duckshoot
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PeeBee
Was that a #duckshoot with both barrels?
😉
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Duck shooting season started early this year!
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As seen on @Trustpilot today:
“I saw the advertisement of Purplebricks on tv and based on the advertisement I decided to go with Purplebricks.”
uk.trustpilot.com/reviews/5a798e196116dd0e9c22aff2
The only thing that surprises me is that the review didn’t drip the usual buzz-words.
Or – maybe the LCT wasn’t “knowledgeable…” “trustworthy…” or “honest”.
Guess we will never know…
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If you want a laugh to brighten up the afternoon;
https://twitter.com/_youhadonejob1/status/960652463589285888
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makes more fun than reading some of the rantings above 🙂
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Someone else wasted £900 instructing Purplebricks to list but not sell their house on Rightmove (unlucky with the 50/50 coin toss)
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-51885189.html
Not sold after 10 weeks and 1 price reduction later so now instructing a traditional no sale no fee agent
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-63926338.html
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PB don’t want their LPE’s chasing sales. That is direct from the MD via my Skype conversation with him.
Therefore if you don’t chase sales through you are NOT an agent, as Abbotts (I think Leigh-on-Sea) found out many moons ago, when a Vendor claimed they should only get paid half their fee as they did not chase the sale through. The court found in her favour.
We also do need to differentiate between online and traditional and the toothless ASA or someone similar now needs to come up with something so the consumer knows the difference as naturally they think that all agents care about is ego’s and getting one over on others which is swollox. Be interesting if a new legal definition came up for LPE’s and therefore can’t be part of another toothless association (Propertymark i’m looking at you!)
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Propertymark i’m looking at you!
You are the only one that is looking at them! 😉
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PB don’t want their LPE’s chasing sales. That is direct from the MD via my Skype conversation with him.
Thats because to do that it costs time and money….that PB are not willing to pay for.
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Jesus wept ! Glad I left this toxic industry last year after 30 years , to do something worthwhile , and which allows me to sleep at night .
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Pray tell us more!
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Blimey fanboys cant you just take off your blinkers for one second and actually see what PB are doing here.
Simply they are being disingenuous,… look it up.
They could choose the route of being straight forward and telling people it as it is…. you know;
you pay us whether you sell or not, or,
we charge you £299 to defer or load this onto our chosen legal firm (who do not get good reviews), or
We aren’t proper estate agents; as there is a lot of difference between our model and theirs, or
Not confuse people by saying we don’t charge commission, whilst not clearly stating how you do charge (or if), or
We allocate x amount of time to sales progression, or
We charge more for viewings, or
We are a property listing service with a ‘helpline’.
The list goes on, all this is is kept from the potential client, they market and operate under the guise of a zero commission estate agent just to get the foot through the door. Some would say Criminal.
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Beano200062
The #fanboys do not wear blinkers.
They have a clear vision – of their objective. They are focussed on that objective and that objective alone.
There is nothing else for them to see – either in their field of vision or outside of it.
If anything enters their field of vision – they simply see past or through it – such is the strength and depth of their focus.
You can not make them see anything else. They will not see anything else. Ever.
Their vision is the truth… their vision is the light…
…their vision is all there is.
The only thing they can’t understand is why we don’t have their vision.
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